The business owner and catastrophe planning

Hi everyone. Thanks very much for your time. My name is Craig Muir and I'm joined by my colleague Shelley Read and we’re both Senior Technical Managers with Royal London. Now today's session. Well, it's pretty obvious as it's on the screen is business owner and catastrophe planning. Now what we're going to do is we're going to consider the need for protection and pension planning for business owners, especially those using their business to fund retirement.

Now we'll look at the wholly and exclusively rule how taxation of dividends works. Then we'll compare the three options of extracting company profits so salary dividends and pension contributions. We’ll then look at the importance of protection planning for business owners and we'll cover the protection landscape, exit planning and the rule of protection advice. Now, key topics in that part of the session will include identifying protection gaps, the impact of losing a key person and employing cash flow modelling to discuss protection with clients.

But before we do just a few housekeeping rules, now, if you're watching this as a live webinar, then you'll be able to raise questions using the chat facility down the right-hand side of your screen, and we'll get back to you with the answer as soon as we possibly can. Alternatively, you can raise your question with your usual Royal London contact if you prefer to do that.

Now, if you're watching a recording of this, then the chat facility won't be available, and you'll only have the option of raising your questions with your usual Royal London contact. Now with regards to your CPD certificate, you'll need to answer some questions after the webinar and that will automatically generate your certificate. Now, overall, this presentation aims to equip you with the knowledge to better understand and address pension and protection needs within your business owner clients financial planning. For this to be CPD-able you need to have some learning objectives and they are by the end of this session, you'll be able to understand the importance and benefits of pensions to the business owner. Explain the various options a business owner has on retirement. Be able to describe how protection should be a key consideration for business owners who are planning on using the business to fund retirement and have a better understanding of how to identify protection opportunities within cash flow modelling exercises.

So, let's start by having a think about the need for pension planning now. Before I think about pensions, purely for many business owners, their business is their pension. And I've certainly heard that plenty of times. I'm sure you have as well, but there are a number of questions to pose to business owners. Isn't that putting all your eggs in one basket? Is there in fact a sale value for the business? I mean, often you'll find that the business owner is the value, and even if there is something to sell, can it be sold at the right time. And the other questions to consider are, what if the owner doesn't want to sell the whole business and, perhaps they want to continue to work part time? How do they afford that?

Another factor is illness isn't often considered, and 79% of SMEs don't have key man cover. And what we find is that even if life cover is considered, illness often isn't. And Shelley, will talk about protection for business owners later. But what if the main person can't work or even direct how the business operates? What impact will that have on income? In fact, will that even be an income? Also, times are rapidly changing, and businesses that we thought have a value no longer do, and we only have to look at the high street to see that. So how does a business owner prepare for that?

Now let's just move on, to thinking about the limited company. And many business owners choose to go down the street either from the beginning or after a couple of years being self-employed. A business owner will pay the various taxes shown here. And however, you badge it up, it's all just tax to the employer owner. But there are three main routes for a business owner to extract profits from their own limited company: salary, of which income tax and employee and employer national insurance will be paid, dividends, which will incur the dividend rate of income tax and pension contributions, which will skip all these tax walls subject to the wholly and exclusively rule. A rule which I'll come on to in a while.

Now, business owners need to consider how best to remunerate themselves and what to do with available money in the business. So, what is the best combination? Especially for the person who wears the hat and pays the tax of employer and employee. Should it be salary, dividend or pension? Well, for most people it isn't a choice of one of these. But instead, a combination of all three. But pensions will always win is the best wrapper here. But unless you're over 55, then, they aren't going to help with a mortgage and, the shopping bills as well. So, let's have a brief reminder of these options in the tax rules that impact them.

Salary for the employer, National insurance contribution is payable depending on the level taken, but no corporation tax. For the employee you've got income tax and employee National insurance, depending on the level taken. For dividends for the employer corporation tax is due, for the employee income tax at the dividend rates. For the pension contributions for the employer, no corporation tax and no employer National insurance. For the employee, no income tax until pension benefits are taken and a no employee National insurance.

Okay, moving on and now thinking about salary. Whilst it might not be the most tax effective strategy it is, of course, important from an access to state pension benefits perspective. And we also need to ensure personal p allowances are effectively utilised. There are a few points we need to consider here. Firstly, one benefit of salary is that it's a means of providing an immediate income, as we'll see shortly. Perhaps the most effective means of avoiding tax and National Insurance charges is to take all benefits in the form of pension. But that that doesn't help pay the mortgage or put food on the table right now. So, while salary may be subject to tax and national insurance, it's often still going to be the best option for the client. What's a little bit more of a grey area is what level of salary should the individual take? Now a couple of points we need to be cognisant of here include that salary is a business expense, whereas dividends aren't. There's no national insurance liability for dividends. And we also need to consider that the level of salary taken will have an impact on the eligibility for state pension benefits Now, that's going to be more obvious when we look at a case study in a few minutes time.

Moving on now and thinking about the business owner and employer pension contributions. Now if an individual or employee were making the pension contribution, there would be a need to have taxable earnings equal to any individual pension contribution over £3,600. But when the client is with the employer and it's an employer contribution, it's different as the wholly and exclusively rule applies. Though directors of limited companies don't need to worry about relevant earnings if it's an employer contribution. Although, I have come across many accountants who think that they can only pay a pension contribution limited to the salary taken. So, be prepared to challenge on that one.

Employer contributions, they're technically unlimited and that almost seems too good to be true. And in reality, although an employer pension contribution could technically be made of, say a million pounds. The individual receiving it would pay a large amount of annual allowance tax charge. So, it is effectively self-policing As I just mentioned, the employer contributions are subject to the wholly and exclusive rule. And here's the rule on the screen. Now essentially, it's the responsibility of the accountant to sign this off. But often they don't fully understand pensions and the pension freedom changes as well. Now the key is that it has to be wholly and exclusively for the purposes of carrying on the trade and is income as opposed to capital in nature.

Normally, if it looks odd, it is. I've always used this example because it was a genuine query, there was a limited company, it was a garage employing ten mechanics, and there were two directors who were the husband and wife. Now, the son was one of the mechanics but not a director, and the parents wanted to pay a large pension contribution for him. However, that wouldn't have been wholly and exclusively for the purpose of the trade after all, why would you make such a large contribution for him and not for the other nine mechanics? So, the answer in that situation was to make him a director and, and he would have then had, additional director's duties and then the pension contributions would technically be unlimited.

The next aspect I want to look at is the taxation of dividends and the dividend allowance. Now one important point to remember with dividends is that dividend income is included in the total tax stack, including that first £500, which is taxed at zero. Now when that, dividend allowance was introduced in April 2016, it was actually £5,000 and it's been reduced several times since then. And then as we know from 6 April 2024, it was reduced to £500. That's gone from £5,000 down to £500 in the space of eight years. So, you can see the rates of dividend tax are on the screen there, basic, higher and additional rates. Now many directors choose to take the majority of their income, the form of dividends. So, this is often the most tax and national insurance efficient means of doing so. Because of the lower rates of income tax and no national insurance on dividends. Well, we're not really considering people making individual pension contributions in this presentation. It's just worth remembering here that dividends do not count as relevant earnings for pension funding purposes.

So, when we talk about tax and in particular dividends, then the order of taxation becomes vital. So, let's have a little reminder. Non savings always comes first. So, as you can see on the screen here salary pension and rental income. Then savings which includes interest and offshore bond gains and then dividend income, followed by onshore bond gains. And lastly CGT when it's above the annual exempt amount. I just thought it might be useful to cover that, as we're going to look at the example next and probably the key point for you to be aware of is that salary comes before dividends in that tax stack.

We're now going to move on to look at opportunities at business year end for businesses. As we know, businesses often wait until nearer to the end of the business year to divide up any profit. And in this case, today, we're going to assume there's a total profit of £400,000 to be extracted between of four directors. They're all raised in England for tax purposes. It makes it a bit easier, now, these tax figures are accurate for the 2025-26 tax year. And we're also going to make this assumption that the employment allowance, which reduces the employer national insurance liability, we're going to assume that it's been used for the other employee's.

So, if we start with the left-hand side here with Miss Mortgage, now Miss Mortgage she needs income. And she's looking to take on a mortgage in the near future. So, she chooses to take all the £100,000 as salary. But after the two types of National insurance plus income tax, she only sees £61,370 in her bank account.

Miss D’Taxman is 60 and is looking to boost her pension savings. Now she decides to pay the full £100,000 as an employer pension contribution. And as it misses all those tax rolls, she sees the full £100,000 in her pension fund. Now, she can take £25,000 as PCLS immediately she has unused annual allowance from previous years to carry forward to avoid any annual allowance tax charges. Now if she wants to take, start taking any income apart from PCLS, then remember she will trigger the money purchase annual allowance. But if she was going to actually retire and if she became a basic rate taxpayer, then she would see £85,000 of that £100,000. Plus, it's an IHT friendly environment. Well, certainly until April 2027.

Mrs. Clever, she's heard that salary and dividends are the best option. So how much of her hundred thousand will she see? Well as you can see after corporation tax, we've assumed £12,570 is taken as salary, so that's personal allowance and £65,572 in dividends. Now, once income taxes paid, the profit extracted is £65,480.

Finally, we have Miss Sensible, who's looking to pay the maximum into their pension without paying a tax charge, now she doesn't have any unused annual allowance to carry forward. So, the maximum she'd be able to pay in is £60,000. She'd also like to take a salary of £12,570. That personal allowance again I'm which of course is tax free. And she takes the remainder as dividends for immediate income needs. Now it means that corporation tax is payable. But she is keeping within the basic rate band for income tax purposes. Now the profit extracted in this scenario is £91,386. But we do have to bear in mind the income tax will be payable, and we've just assumed the basic rate again on the pension when it's withdrawn. So that gives us that lower figure in the bracket £82,386. So, the ideal scenario for most directors is to maximise pension contributions, keep dividends within the basic rate band and make sure that enough salary is being taken to ensure the client would receive state benefits. And then between dividends and salary, have enough to live on as well.

So, for the business owner, we also need to think about the questions on the screen. So has the director been a member of a pension scheme in the past. So is that available carry forward. Is there too much cash in the business? Now this is important mindset kicking about IHT planning as if there's too much cash in the business, then that might not all qualify for business relief.

In addition, if the business folded then that cash would be an asset of their business and not protected as it would normally be in the pension wrapper. How old is the director? Is that a plan for retirement? Is that a value in the business and can there be guaranteed to be a value in years to come? Again, as I mentioned earlier, the last few years have shown us that the businesses that we thought were rock solid aren't always. And another question is enough salary being taken to make sure that the state benefits will be payable, including state pension and other state benefits, not forgetting things like maternity allowance for your female clients as well.

Just before I pass over to Shelley to consider how protection policies can address some of these points, I just want to touch briefly on the announcements around agricultural and business property relief announced in the October 2024 budget. Now, obviously these have the potential to impact business owners. And they're really relevant when discussing exit strategies or catastrophe planning for your business owner clients.

Now, this isn't an inheritance tax session, so I just want to touch on the main points so you're aware of them. So, in the October 2024 budget, it was announced that there will be 1 million pounds IHT free allowance covering qualifying agricultural or business property or a combination of the two. So just for clarity, that's £1 million in total for agricultural property relief and business property relief. Not £1 million each. Now this takes effect from 6 April 2026. And it's important to be aware that this is not transferable between spouses like the standard or the residential nil rate bands are that each spouse could have their own £1 million allowance in their own right. So, you may have heard about the potential for full IHT relief on £3 million. Now that could be the case if spouses jointly owned the house worth £1 million and each had qualifying agricultural property or business property of £1 million apiece. On first death, the full £1 million agricultural property relief and business property relief is used and the standard and residence nil rate band passes on to the other spouse, so and £1 million has to be passed on IHT and IHT free to the beneficiaries by the deceased spouse, and the surviving spouse now has £1 million of their own agricultural property relief and business property relief allowance remaining, and £1 million of their own and inheritance standard and residence nil rate band to use on second death.

So overall, that's £3 million in total. Now assets in excess of the £1 million Agricultural Property Relief and Business Property Relief allowance will attract 50% relief rather than 100%. And as you can see at the bottom, the IHT relief on qualifying unlisted shares including Aim share. So, the alternative Investment Market shares will only qualify for 50% inheritance tax relief from 6 April 2026. They will still need to be held for two years to qualify for that relief.

Now I'm going to pass you over to Shelley to delve into the protection points that could benefit your clients. Over to you, Shelley.

Thanks very much, Craig. And a warm welcome to the final part of today's webinar. And what I'd like to do is to introduce protection, really to dovetail with everything Craig has been talking about.

So, I'll look at the options for a business owner to exit a business paying particular attention to a catastrophe such as premature death, an accident or diagnosis of a critical illness. Or indeed may be a less serious illness, but still leaving the individual unable to work and this might mean that those plans cannot happen, or they might need to happen much sooner than expected.

So, to help us achieve the objectives Craig set out earlier, I've got a fairly packed agenda, which you can see on the screen right now. So, I’ll look at the protection landscape, we’ll consider the protection landscape and remind ourselves of the reason businesses need a real robust protection portfolio. We'll look at exit planning and I'll consider the options facing a business. Then we'll ask the question, does it really happen? And I'll show you that it certainly does and the real catastrophic implications. And then we'll look at where protection can fit in. Then assistance in identifying this protection gap. And finally, the importance of reviewing your business owner client’s protection needs.

Let's move on then and consider why is protection considered the starting point to financial planning. If you think about it for a moment, the role protection advice plays, it's there to make sure that clients can retain their financial resilience if they face an unexpected life event. It's a way to ensure that there's money on the table when the worst happens, a way to help clients and their families pay off debts and maintain their standards of living when the worst happens. And this is really so important when talking to businesses. So, protection insurance is crucial for business owners because it helps safeguard that central business, including its owners, employee’s income and profit, and premature death or illness can cause financial devastation.

Let's have a look why it matters so much. And first of all, I'll look at control. So, if a co-owner or shareholder dies or becomes incapacitated, the business could face disputes over ownership. Protection can ensure that the remaining partners have the means to buy out the affected party shares, and this will maintain stability and most importantly, keep that control within the people who built that business. Let's consider debt and financial obligations. Now business loan protection can ensure that debts are repaid in the event of death or a critical illness. And worth pointing out, many business loans have personal guarantees by the owners, so loan protection would also prevent personal assets from being at risk. Profit - key people in a business generally have a big impact on profit, and having the appropriate protection in place means that profit can be maintained by helping a company continue operations, manage that financial shock and avoid costly disruptions caused by illness, accident or again, premature death. And overall it helps to prevent a direct hit to profits while the business stabilises itself.

Now death in service, offering relevant life or group death in service policies to employees, I think can really boost morale and loyalty. It can help in recruitment and also retaining staff and all while we're supporting the family of employees in a tax efficient way.

But before we look at a protection solution for our business owner clients, I think one of the easiest ways to demonstrate this is with an example case study. So let me introduce you to Royal London Sockets. Now they're a small manufacturing company and I would hazard a guess that you have very similar companies in your client bank or that you're certainly aware of and heading up this operation. We've got four key directors, Ruth, Lee, Anita and Mona. Now they're all responsible and specialise in different areas of the business, whether it be sales, finance, operations or indeed the managing director role.

So, what are the risks that they are planning for? What are their main concerns? And this really is an important starting point before we even look at any business protection solutions. So, we might, during our initial meeting factor some sort of matrix, maybe like the one you can see on screen right now. And this is looking at the at the probability of these risks and of course, the impact. Now you can see here, for example, the chance of an employee, not a key person here, but the chance of an employee resigning in a firm is probably quite high, but the impact is quite low. But while having a major fire or flood is quite low, the impact would definitely be really high. Now, I think most companies don't think twice about taking out cover for such events as fire, theft and flood or even a data breach. They might even have a disaster recovery plan in place to ensure that they can continue to trade should the worst happen. But have they given any thought to the even bigger disaster of one of the business owners or key people becoming ill or sadly dying prematurely? And Craig really alluded to this earlier. What in reality would happen if a key person had to take extended time off work due to a serious illness or sadly passed away suddenly?

So, imagine this is the managing director. The person who drives the company has the vision and the plans to grow and develop. Or it could be the sales director who has all those major relationships with their key customers. Or it might be the operations director who manages the day to day running of the company, and maybe also responsible for buying the parts for our example company, Royal London Sockets. Those parts that they need for manufacturing. As well as cash flow, think about what impact it would make on their fixed costs, their pension contributions, and maybe their dividends and generally their long-term goals.

So, what might Lee’s exit strategy look like? So here on this slide now you can see just a few suggested options. So, first of all, his plan might be to sell his shares of that business to fund his retirement. But there are some things really to consider here. How much might he shares be worth, for example? And indeed, who might buy them? And if Fred died prematurely or got sick at that point in time, how attractive would the business be? And do the other shareholders have the funds to be able to buy Lee out? He might be thinking of leaving the shares to his wife or partner or children, but again, at that time, will they be interested in taking over his role? Indeed, do they have the skills, knowledge and expertise to do this? Might they even have a remote family member who thinks that they could possibly take over? And if not, we're back to the same question as a few minutes ago. Who would they sell those shares to? And maybe more importantly, who would want to buy them?

Or Lee might not be planning on doing anything. He might just want to work till the very end. But again, how realistic is this? Does he have any of the savings or pension funds that might allow him to cut down his hours and workload? And again, what’s Fred's health like? Well, it could be really excellent at the moment, but we have no idea what might happen over the following months and years.

I think the big question we should be asking Lee, and his co-directors is, what if? What would happen if death, serious illness or incapacity meant those plans just can't be achieved? Lee wasn't able to achieve his exit strategy and what could it mean? What if? What could it mean for them or their family and the business?

So, as I said in the agenda, let's have a look now at does it really happen? Well, I think we all know that these things do happen, but do we really appreciate the impact? So, a lot of you might remember back in 2007, the businessman and non-executive director of Chelsea Football Club, Phillip Carter, was tragically killed in a helicopter crash just as he was returning from a Champions League Cup match. Now his son and the pilot sadly also lost their lives. Now Phillip's job on a day-to-day basis was running Carter and Carter, which was a hugely successful training company. And actually, the day before his death, the shares were valued at £13 each, with a total value just over £500 million. Now, the shares dropped in value by about 20% on the news of his death, but actually within six months the shares had plummeted to just over £0.82.

And they were then subsequently suspended on the stock exchange. And in 2008, only about 12 months after Philip's death, the administrators were called in and the business ceased to trade. So, what are the effects of losing a key person? So, if we go back to Philip, he was obviously key to Carter and Carter's success. He had that vision and direction. He was the founder of the company. He was the chief exec. He had that leadership that brought everyone together. And it was all those skills that gave the creditors confidence. And much like Carter and Carter, the effects of losing a key person can be hugely detrimental to a business.

And the key person, remember, isn't necessarily just the chief exec. A key person is anyone really, whose death or serious illness would more than likely have a detrimental effect on the company. Now, some companies might have several key people, such as our Royal London Sockets or just the one. But to identify a key individual, you do really need to have a good look and a good understanding of the business itself.

So, let's have a look. Where can protection fit in? Well, the importance of business protection is quite often overlooked. And it really is vitally important to help business owners plan and should something terrible happen, be able to provide a lump sum to hopefully minimise disruption and for trading to be able to continue. So, let's look now at a solution using protection.

How do we introduce the idea of business protection and the solution to protecting the business against these unforeseen, but potentially devastating life events? Well, I think when we're talking business protection, it's always a good idea to really try and steer away from language like business protection and business assurance but instead use language that means something. And most business owners will be familiar with language like business continuity, for example.

But what we're really asking here is how they would source a replacement, and what would the financial consequences be following the loss, either short or long term, of a key person? And this can open the door to such areas as key person and loan protection. And what we mean by this is maintaining the business's ability to repay those corporate loans and debts if someone became ill or passed away. Now, some loans that might benefit from these kinds of conversations might include bank loans. We've seen an awful lot in recent years of CBILLS and bounce back loans following the pandemic. And also, directors’ loans accounts are really important. And also, don't forget those personal guarantees as well. Now key person loan protection can be set up to pay a lump sum to protect profits that a key person generates for the business.

Now moving on to the middle column. Business succession. What will happen to these shares if there was death or critical illness? And again, this allows us to introduce the idea of business succession and shareholder protection, which is an in a nutshell is really all about retaining ownership and control for the other directors, ensuring it's kept in the hands of those who built it, but also to ensure that the family of the deceased or the seriously ill receives fair value for their share of the business.

And finally, how can protection help support the family of the key person employee if they sadly pass away? Well, we're looking here, as at providing death in service as an individual basis by means of a relevant life policy.

So let's look now at identifying a protection gap. Let's look at some of the tools and ideas we can support you with to help demonstrate to your clients the real need for a protection conversation. Let's have a look at cash flow modelling. So many of you have used or are familiar with a cash flow modelling process. But if you're not familiar, cash flow modelling allows us to give a detailed picture of a client's assets of their investments, debts, income, and expenditure. And it allows us to project that forward year by year by using assumed rates of growth, income inflation, salary rises and interest rates importantly, as well. And what we can do then is to bolt on some life events. So, for example, if your, small business owner says that they want to retire early or they ask, what happens if they get divorced? They might ask you, should they take all their pension tax free cash or what would happen if they wanted to draw some cash for emergencies or to help their children?

And recently, the obvious concern about the possible IHT on pensions. Another key question that is often asked is how about if I need care in later life? The list of events really can be endless and it's very much personal to the individual, but I think this can really help the client to see the importance of financial planning.

So, let's look now what does it mean to the client? So, a good way, I think, is to let your clients actually visualise their business and then show them visually again, how protection can fit in to provide that solution. So, looking at this example we've got on the screen now let's imagine we've got an individual. Maybe it's Lee. He's a director of Royal London Sockets. He's 45 years old. And let's assume he plans to retire at age 65. So, let's look at projecting the sustainability of his current and projected assets to that stage. Now, what we can see here is that up to age 65, things are going great. He's building up those assets and wealth. And then after 65, he's then enjoying all that wealth and his hard work. But the big question really is what if catastrophe struck? What if Lee maybe suffered a heart attack at around the age of 60? Might now be looking to retire early. Or what if actually Lee passed away? What would this mean for Lee's family? What would their financial position be now? And also, what would that mean for the business?

So could actually showing the types of risk and catastrophes that Lee faces be a really great way to introduce the subject of protection, really showing that there is a solution to ensure their long-term plans can happen. So just a question for you. Do you already factor in these types of risks with your clients within their cash flow modelling? And if not using something like this, might it make it easier to have those compelling protection conversations and show that it doesn't take long for Lee’s estate to be in deficit?

Now, on the next slide, let's have a look at attitude to risk. Now I suspect that talking about pension and investments with your clients also brings out the conversation about attitude to risk and capacity for loss. So really what we're trying to do here is understand the risk the clients are prepared to take with their money and also ascertain how much they could actually afford to lose. What's their capacity for loss? So, the attitude to risk. This is really subjective because it's based on feelings and beliefs. And capacity for loss is objective because it's based on the client's ability to absorb falls the value of their investment.

So, what would a risk profile be for a protection client? And what I'm really interested in here is if we took the exact same approach to protection with the same client, what might it look like? What would the risk profile be for a client who has no protection at all? Maybe they've got a mortgage, own a business, have a young family. What might it look like? Well, I think as you can see on the screen here, we'd have to say that they would be sitting on the very adventurous side of this scale. And are they aware of that? And is that really what they would want.

So, let's have a look at reviewing protection needs. So, as I come towards the end of my part of today's webinar, let's just have a look at the great opportunity, I think, to have these business protection conversations. So, let's just remind ourselves a key phrase that comes from the recent Consumer Duty directed by the FCA. So, they say the regular review. We require of firms to provide an opportunity to identifying any new or emerging harms. So, in my opinion, as well as giving a business owner clients the very best outcomes and avoiding any foreseeable harm, then it's very clear that the FCA also require advisers to review their client's protection needs regularly to ensure that those existing protection plans are still fit for purpose.

Or, as this exactly says, to discuss any changes or any new areas which need to be considered when looking at that protection solution. And this may well be linked to a business they are starting or are already trading. Now, I do think that this, as you can see on the slide now, is a world of opportunity. So, with the business protection focus, here are some of the areas I think could start a real compelling business protection conversation. So let me just in the last few minutes, just pick out a few. Maybe your client is starting a new business, expanding or taking on more employees. Perhaps they're looking at providing death-in-service as a recruitment or staff retention focus, or even taking on additional borrowing, such as a director's loan. Now all these stages need a protection recommendation.

Now, a few of the other areas on this slide relate to trust and business protection. And I think it's just important just to remind you, while we are talking about business protection and trust, to remember that business protection policies cannot be retrospectively placed in trust. So, this might mean a complete review of client’s policies.

So, if we move on to our next slide, just a few questions that I think might be important or spark a conversation with your business owner clients. Do you have clients who are shareholder of a small or medium enterprise? Could they benefit from a conversation? Well, absolutely. And do they expect to sell those shares at some point in the future? And will the proceeds of that sale be used in lifetime financial planning? And finally, are their aspirations being insured. All of these, I think, will start your clients to think about their business, think about their family, their fellow directors, and really what their hopes and aspirations are.

So, I think that's probably pretty much all that I wanted to talk to you about today, to dovetail with Craig’s start, of this session at the beginning. Just on the screen now are our learning outcomes. I'm pretty confident the objectives set by Craig at the beginning have now become outcomes. And just on the final slide, I will leave you with the adviser.royallondon.com adviser address. And really, all that's left is from both myself and Craig to say a huge thank you for taking the time to dial in and to listen to our webinar about catastrophe planning. Thank you so much.